The Maple Street Press Irish Kickoff Series: Part Four (Recruiting)
by Eric Murtaugh on Aug 2, 2011 9:55 AM EDT
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Pat Mitsch is back with us talking about recruiting at Notre Dame, a topic everyone is always interested in.
If you've missed any of the previous installments, click on the links below.
I'm currently working my way through the 2011 MSP Irish Kickoff and I'm loving it. If you trust that I wouldn't lie to you about its awesomeness, click here and get your Notre Dame football fix.
This will be the last post for readers to enter their names into a raffle to win a free copy of the magazine. We will announce the winner with the Miscellaneous Questions for Part Five in this series.
If you wish to win the free copy, simply leave a comment here or in any of the preceding three parts of our interview with Pat Mitsch.
And now, to the world of recruiting....
OFD: It is generally agreed upon by our writers at One Foot Down that Brian Kelly will be an even better recruiter than Charlie Weis. Do you agree?
Mitsch: I think it's fair to say that Kelly will turn out to be a better recruiter than Charlie because (1) I expect his teams to win more games and (2) he clearly has a time-tested plan to building a recruiting class that helps him see through recruiting hype.
However, I think Charlie should get some props as a strong one-on-one recruiter. Sure he annoyed some high school coaches with his arrogance, but Charlie knew campus as well as any ND coach and wore his love for his alma mater on his sleeve. His success rate at getting commitments from players that made a visit to campus was pretty impressive.
As a whole staff though, I think Kelly's staff has already proven more capable top to bottom and will continue to do so.
OFD: There has been a lot of talk lately about the Irish not taking a quarterback in the 2012 class. If true, if this a wise decision?
Mitsch: I'm a pretty strong proponent of taking one quarterback in every class. I realize you're not always going to get a superstar or even future starter every year, but I think it's just one of those positions that needs a spot in every recruiting class, especially when the coach runs a QB-centric offense like Kelly does.
Unlike most positions, QB is sort of an all-or-nothing spot. So if a guy gets beat out, a transfer is an all too common way to find more snaps. And transfers are even more common when a school like ND recruits in a boom or bust fashion where a class with no QB is followed up by a class with two or three.
I'm hopeful ND will find a suitable QB option later in the year like they did last year with Everett Golson because while the QB depth chart is pretty deep now, history suggests some of those guys might not be around for the long haul (and that includes just moving positions, as Luke Massa has already done)
OFD: All things considered, is the 2011 class the best (or have the potential to be) the best collection of talent to come to South Bend in almost 20 years?
Mitsch: Certainly on the defensive side of the ball I think that argument could be made. However let's not overlook a few other recent classes that came in with a load of talent on both sides of the ball (which wasn't always developed to potential) like the '08 Crist-Floyd-Rudolph-Fleming-Filer class or the '03 Quinn-Samardzija-Zibby-Abiamiri-Laws-Carlson class.
The one thing I think the 2011 class missed on was landing a great running back to round out the offensive side of the ball (although here's to hoping McDaniel has a great career)
OFD: The recruiting in the secondary was considered solid in 2011, but the current verbal commits there for 2012 are outstanding. With the talent of the front seven from 2011 combined with the talent of the secondary for 2012, when was the last time Notre Dame has been in this good of shape for the future on defense?
Mitsch: It is pretty tempting to think of a 2013 starting lineup of Lynch-Nix-Tuitt-Shembo-Williams-Calabrese-Grace-Shepard-Darby-Motta-Hardy (and that's not even including some of the talented guys on the bench). It has been awhile since ND could look forward to a defense that loaded.
Of course, it is recruiting, so holding on to the commitments of Darby and Shepard will probably be a fight to the finish even though they are already committed (just look at last year's crazy finish). The other key to having a bright future on defense will be consistency in the defensive coaching staff, whether that means keeping the same guys, or at least hiring replacement coaches with similar ideas and schemes. No more back and forth switching in defensive philosophies please.
OFD: Which one of the assistants does Brian Kelly not want to lose the most as a recruiter?
Mitsch: Tony Alford has been a force on the recruiting trail since the day he showed up on campus. He's the guy I'd put at the top of Kelly's "do not lose" list, especially considering all of the other top recruiters (Diaco, Martin, Elston, possibly Cooks) work the defensive side of the ball. Keeping Alford around for a few more years would be fantastic for ND both from a coaching and recruiting perspective.
OFD: If there is one state you think the coaching staff would like to increase their reputation and ability to pull recruits out from, which would it be?
Mitsch: Good question. Kelly has assigned a few coaches to recruiting Florida so it's pretty clear he places strong emphasis on getting players out of that talent-rich state. And California has been very good to ND the past few years, including Shepard and Greenbury this year.
But I'd have to say Texas just because getting players to actually leave the state has been so tough with Mack Brown locking down all the top talent in the state lately. Getting guys like McDaniel and Brown (and almost Okotcha) was a good start and I think Nicky Barrati is going to be a great player for ND. But I think Kelly would love for ND to start pulling even more recruits from the football-crazy state of Texas.
OFD: What are the three main things the coaching staff should sell about Notre Dame while traveling the country to recruit? Where does winning fit in with that discussion?
Mitsch: Same as it ever was. Winning, tradition, and education. Winning has to be included because the cream of the crop recruits aren't usually swayed by ND's Catholic character, top graduation rate, or fantastic facilities. They want to play for a winner.Kelly has been that so far in his career and if he can show recruits he will stay that way at ND, the sky is the limit.
The other factors I mentioned: tradition and education, have historically been the two strongest sales pitches to recruits (and their parents) when trying to differentiate ND from the local state school. So far Kelly and his staff have been pretty good at selling all three. Some might think style of play (spread offense, 3-4 defense) might be up there, but I think it takes a back seat to winning, tradition, and education. Recruits will settle for a scheme they aren't currently comfortable with if they know it will help them win big in college.
OFD: As of right now, the 2012 class consists of two offensive linemen, two receivers, two outside linebackers, two corners, three safeties, and one long snapper. If you could cherry pick an elite recruit for any position, which would it be?
Mitsch: I think I'd pick safety Shaq Thompson. I realize ND already has a few safety recruits, but landing an elite safety to pair with Darby and Shepard would be fantastic. Kelly said defensive back was the key to this class so I'm all for getting the best ones we can find. On the other hand, passing on Dorial Green-Beckham might be a tall task as a 6'6" receiver that is the #1 recruit in the country is pretty tough to turn away. Imagine him in Kelly's spread offense.
OFD: Name one player from the 2011 class that you think is flying under the radar and could surprise a lot of people and become a multi-year starter for Notre Dame.
Mitsch: This is a tough one. With all of the attention on the Big Three defensive recruits, there are plenty of talented guys flying under the radar (at least until practice starts in a few days). I'll pick a player on each side of the ball if you don't mind.
How about Matthias Farley on offense and Jalen Brown on defense. Both are three star guys and both have an excellent chance to see the field as freshmen and become multi-year starters. Honorable mention to Ben Councell and Troy Niklas, although I think it's a bit of a stretch to say either guy has been flying under the radar to this point. Many ND fans are pretty excited about their potential.
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Notre Dame
recruiting I think has been at an elite level as far back as I remember so I expect a top 20 recruiting class as a ND fan, where I really get excited though is how these young guys develop. I’m really excited to see how the underclassmen turn out in the next few years, and I’m excited to see another excellent year of college football!
"It's ludicrous these mortals even attempt to enter my realm!" - Mike Tyson.
Recruiting vs. Player Development
I have to agree with some of the comments in the article about player development. That is just as important (if not more so) than getting top tier talent in recruiting. Ideally, you get both, but BK’s track record on development speaks for itself.
While some have been disappointed with the approach (at least early on), its hard to argue with the results in the 2011 class. They have done a phenomenal job identifying the players early on and focusing on some of the “diamonds in the rough” while CW’s approach was more of a who’s who of top tier recruits.
I would love to see this staff stay intact for 2012 as well, but it will be difficult with plenty of attention being paid to Alford, Martin and likely Molnar with success.
2003 Class
Wow, that is a pretty good group. Thanks Ty. Too bad you only recruited 2 OL that year (Harris and Sullivan). Still, you add Ndukwe and a few other solid players in Thomas and Brockington, that has to be one of the top ten classes in the last 20 years, right?
2003 is definitely up there.
Sky rockets in flight.
by Eric Murtaugh on Aug 2, 2011 2:19 PM EDT up reply actions
2003 Turned Out Good
But Ty lucked into Brady Quinn. He recruited Ndukwe from Dublin Coffman but didn’t offer Brady. Ndukwe’s father had to talk Willingham into recruiting Quinn. He didn’t even spot him while recruiting the WR he was throwing the ball to. SMH
Recruiting Kelly-style
1. Kelly’s recruiting philosophy will pay off big-time – Skill, Big Skill, Big – and sets him apart from Weis. There may occasionally be unique recruits like Troy Niklas, who can step from Big to Big Skill from DE to OLB. Certain athletes like Daniels, Golson, Lynch, Tuitt, Koyack and Grace are natural at certain positions, but having players like G. Atkinson, Farley, McDaniel, Carrico and Hounshell, as well as Nichols, Spond, Collinsworth, B Jackson gives the staff a flexibility the previous staff did not have.
2. The ability to develop players by this staff as well as the S&C program cannot be overstated – Nichols and Schwenke were three stars, for instance. How many pounds have these guys put on? Okwara, Harrell, Prosise, Baratti and Perkins are three stars in this class.
3. We have a QB in this class if we need him – Baratti. With three players verbally committed who are classified as S – Baratti, Prosise, and Turner – Kelly is still recruiting Thompson, Reggie Daniels, and Elijah Shumate. Kelly (vs Weis) looks at the possibilites should one of them commit.
4. Kelly can overrecruit at a position based on this philosophy and on needs. After this year, we will see.
5. What can’t be underestimated is how Kelly is recruiting speed – on defense with OLB and the secondary – and someone who has a team-oriented mentality (RKG). The staff is also confident they can develop such a player into relatively new positions.
6. Remember Weis missing on LOTs? He left with just Lombard committed for 2010. James would have been an awesome Kelly recruit, but who of us thought much of Tate Nichols at the time? Since then, Kelly has solidified the holes left from that year. Only Z Mart, Watt, Lombard and Nichols remain from those two years (2009, 2010).
7. I’d like to see recruiting rankings based on two year classes. How do you think 2011 and 2012 together will rank nationally, though we have a long way to go with 2012?
8. I don’t want to lose anyone from this coaching staff. They are all pit bulls. Isn’t Diaco Italian for pitbull? However, one of the unseen heroes is Ed Warriner, who knows the type of OL prospects the offense needs and has been remolding the OL. I expect he has provided input into which OT prospects can be switched to the interior. We will be talking about him if DGB commits to the Irish.
9. The last time the Irish did not get a QB commit, Jimmy Clausen committed the following year, I believe.
I'm a big Tate Nichols fan
I hope he develops into a star. I also really like Bruce Heggie because I’m a sucker for the underdog. It’ll be a huge win for Kelly if he becomes a regular contributor, maybe not even necessarily a starter. But with his move to guard, I think he’ll take another “redshirt” year to learn the position and then maybe be in the mix to replace Trevor Robinson next spring.
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2009 was the last time the Irish did not get a QB
That led to a depth chart nightmare last year when Clausen left early. Clausen committed the year after Weis signed Jones and Frazer. Having said that, I’m fine with not taking a QB this year. I do think it is important to redshirt Golson (barring an emergency) in order to stagger the QB eligibility between Rees/Hendrix/Golson.
Points 1, 2, and 5 are oh so important!
Sky rockets in flight.
by Eric Murtaugh on Aug 2, 2011 6:59 PM EDT up reply actions
Do we know how "mean" any of these recruits are... Especially on the defensive side?
Because it seems to me, to have a truly elite defense you just need an animal or 2 on the defensive side of the ball, it really is a different mind set. And Im not sure that style of defensive player can be lured to ND. Manti Te’o is great, but he is a rare piece… Kind of reminds me of Patrick Willis… Maybe not quite as physical.
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The one thing that concerns me about recruiting so far (and really, it's only one thing)
is our lack of depth at guard and center. We’re pulling in tackles left and right (haha get it?) but not doing much in the interior. That said, I’m sure the staff has a plan. I’m guessing their strategy is bring the big, athletic offensive linemen (which will almost always be playing tackle in HS) and rely on the fact that 18 year old kids are still growing and move a few inside. It just makes me nervous to see so many players listed as “OT” and few “OG.”
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I've been saying that for a while too
Sky rockets in flight.
by Eric Murtaugh on Aug 2, 2011 6:58 PM EDT up reply actions
I am less concerned about the shortage of recruits on the interior line.
I read an article recently about Robert Gallery that touched on moving tackles to guard. The piece argued that drafting LTs was less risky than a lot of other positions because if a guy can’t handle LT then he can be moved to RT and if he can’t hang there he can be moved inside to guard. Gallery may have been a bust as a LT but he has been a solid starter at G.
by millar on Aug 2, 2011 11:05 PM EDT via mobile up reply actions
Don't Worry
This is done by design fellas. Kelly looks for athletic versatile OL. Hegarty is going to be playing Guard. Don’t get caught up in what players are listed at by recruiting sites. A number of these guys can play mutliple positions on the line.
Nick Martin – OG/C/OT
Bruce Heggie – OG/C
Prestwood – OG/OT
Hanratty – OG/C
Mark Harrell – Will be an OG
Brad Carrico – OG
Taylor Decker – Likely will be an OT
Just a few examples but don’t get caught up in perception by recruiting sites. Not all of these guys are OT’s just like not all of the “DE’’s” last season were being recruited as defensive ends.
Yeah, that's what I thought
I would bet most high schools put their best lineman at tackle, whether he projects to tackle or guard at the college level.
I just hope the staff is good about evaluating who they think will play tackle/guard/center and get him the snaps he needs. It’s not going to help these kids’ development if their constantly moving around the line. But I don’t think there’s any reason to think the staff will do that. They seem to know what they’re doing.
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Not as concerned I am
with whether someone is rated an OT or OG. Those with the longer wingspan and the flexibility to seal the corner and to handle the pass rush will be moved to OT.
Right now our OTs range from 6-4 (ZMart) to 6-8 (Taterpillar). Nuss has moved back inside. Lombard could. Our interior line ranges from 6-3 (Watt, Cave) to 6-5 (Nuss, Robinson).
Expect our future OL to have 6-5 interior lineman with OTs at 6-7 or more you should. (Decker, possibly Banner)
OC is the real question
By far, I think that is the toughest role to transition into for a lineman, especially in this offense. The thing about a great OC is that you never notice the little things that make them so good—shotgun snaps, changing protection at the line, anchoring the line. These things aren’t learned in a day, and rarely are there great OCs coming out of high school. While I think BK has the right strategy getting athletic linemen with good footwork, it will be tough to fill that hole if you don’t recruit specifically for it. I think it is likely you see Nick Martin, Hanratty or Hounshell get cross trained at OC this year, preparing them for Cave’s departure after 2012.
Taterpillar!!
Our line is going to be monstrous in a year or two. Absolutely friggin’ huge!
Sky rockets in flight.
by Eric Murtaugh on Aug 3, 2011 10:07 AM EDT up reply actions
Our 2012 offensive line
could be: Z Mart, Watt, Cave, Lombard, Nichols.
/drools
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If I can sum up everything:
Kelly realized we need to get bigger on the lines and faster everywhere else.
He’s doing that.
And there was much rejoicing.
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I'm the guy in the gray beard.
Sky rockets in flight.
by Eric Murtaugh on Aug 3, 2011 11:36 AM EDT up reply actions
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