Will Things Ever Change Inside Notre Dame Stadium?
by Eric Murtaugh on Oct 14, 2010 7:42 PM EDT
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PrintRecently, the Sporting News ranked Notre Dame Stadium as the second best of "places to watch college football." This isn’t a big surprise for most Irish fans or anyone who has stepped foot on Notre Dame’s campus and attended a game inside the House that Rockne Built.
However, the curious thing is how much debate continues to rage on about the positives and negatives of Notre Dame Stadium and what needs to be done, if anything at all, to improve the experience for fans.
This weekend the Western Michigan Broncos will be the first MAC team to ever play at Notre Dame* and as a result the nation’s second longest consecutive sell-out streak is in jeopardy.
*First MAC team, but Notre Dame has played Western Michigan before, defeating the Broncos by a combined score of 94-0 in 1919 and 1920.
There have been some close calls in the past with "the streak" and even though every ticket is sold, some claim that there have been plenty of empty seats in the past to warrant an end to such sell-out claims.
As it is, there is another real threat that the streak will end from a monetary standpoint this weekend, although we’ll just have to wait and see.
But back to the stadium itself and the positive and negatives associated with the South Bend mecca.
Will things ever change?
Before we dig in deeper into this issue let me claim that I am indeed a traditionalist when it comes to these matters, although I don’t think we can really just shout, "it’s a tradition!" and never think about changing anything or enhancing the experience at Notre Dame.
I’ve probably brought this topic up a half dozen times over the past year or so and I think it is something that should be discussed because A.) We’re playing Western Michigan this weekend and I couldn’t muster the energy to write any sort of preview for the game and B.) I thought we would see some changes (however small) with a new coaching staff and I’m not sure anything has happened.
For convenience’s sake let’s break this down into different topics.
The Tunnel Walk and Field Entrance
Last week’s entrance onto the field for the Irish was really the impetus for writing this piece. One of the reasons why I was excited to have someone like Brian Kelly as head coach at Notre Dame was because I thought the team’s entrance onto the field would be greatly improved.
The home opener against Purdue was fairly decent and just having the coach run out in front of the team brings about a little more excitement.
But since then the entrance has been one large ball of suck with none worse than last weekend’s against Pittsburgh.
As usual the team gathered in the tunnel and the cheerleaders ran out onto the field led by the leprechaun and for some reason a couple of random Irish players. Naturally, this elicited a decent amount of applause from the spectators.
The only problem was, the rest of the team didn’t follow suit and only after the initial wave of cheerleaders and mascot raced out onto the field and the crowd died down, did the rest of the players run out in the most uninspiring of ways.
What’s wrong with this whole process?
On television the entrance is almost always terrible. If Clemson or Virginia Tech taking the field is like watching a popular rock band take the stage, witnessing Notre Dame take the field is like watching a dried up country star slowly amble towards the microphone.
In person, the run out is probably the most disappointing aspect of the entire weekend experience (I had very high hopes initially at my first game and my second live-viewing was much worse than the first).
On the one hand it’s amazing because obviously you’re at Notre Dame, you’re excited to watch the game and all of these players and coaches who a lot of us look up to and cheer for are only feet away in some instances.
But from a more primitive "let’s get jacked up because the Fighting Irish are about to run onto the field," it is a rather boring scene.
Is there any way to improve this? Here’s what I think:
Enclose the Tunnel
One of the main problems with the run out onto the field is that everyone in the stadium can see the players spilling out of the tunnel before they actually take the field. This is coupled with the lack of music or means of celebration that precedes the run out and it is produces a rather lackluster moment.
What if the tunnel was temporarily closed off for the run out?
What if there was a retractable awning that came down and covered the tunnel? You could even paint it metallic gold and have it resemble the golden dome.
At the end of it, you could attach a giant paper covering with the fighting leprechaun, ND monogram or shamrock logos and have the players break through it as they run out to the field.
Personally, I think this is a great idea and is something rather simple that would add to the punch of having the Irish take the field. It would force the spectators to focus more on the tunnel and there would be more excitement and anticipation as they await the team bursting out from behind the "golden dome."
Enroll in the Ray Lewis School of Celebration
My first idea will bring an estimated 39.4 percent increase in excitement to the stadium, but something needs to be done to get the players really jacked up. I don’t understand why they continue to just jog onto the field like nothing special is happening.
Running through the paper will automatically make them run a little faster and although I’m not advocating any player(s) come out by themselves and do a little dance like Ray Lewis, it would be nice if we saw some more emotion out there.
Could we get some mandatory flying chest bumps and soaring high fives at least?
Here’s another idea, why not let one of the team captains race out with a shillelagh in his hand and give it to the leprechaun at midfield? I bet you half the Notre Dame fan base doesn’t even know the leprechaun brandishes a shillelagh in the first place and this would be a totally bad ass way to promote the awesome Irish club.
Loudness=Home Field Advantage
Notre Dame Stadium is the 21st largest non-racing venue in the United States, yet its size is considerably larger than the noise the stadium produces each Saturday.
It is this topic that has produced a ton of arguments and discussions about "what’s wrong" with Notre Dame Stadium.
Let’s break it down.
The Bowl Shape
It is often repeated that one of the main reasons why Notre Dame Stadium is not as loud as many other venues around the country is because of its open-top bowl shape.
Essentially, a large portion of the crowd noise that is generated fizzles away into the open sky above.
Is there a solution to this?
Clearly the university isn’t about to build a new stadium just to enhance the crowd noise, but what about adding small awnings (bonus points for bringing up awnings a second time!) similar to the ones used by Alabama and other schools?
Hey, it’s a thought.
The Crowd Make-Up
This is the most talked about issue and probably the biggest issue, although it is pretty much close to unsolvable without inherent changes to the stadium.
First, the Fighting Irish student section is much smaller than most other schools. Notre Dame has just under 12,000 students while Penn State has about eight times that number.
Talk about fighting an uphill battle.
With a much smaller student section (half the size of Penn State’s), Notre Dame is afforded many more seats to fans that are not going to be as crazy or loud as college kids.
This is added to the throngs of supporters who fill the stadium every weekend but who are otherwise tight lipped, not of the cheering persuasion and often cantankerous. We’ve all heard stories about people being yelled at by certain fans for standing up and cheering and also about prompt ushers who are ready to throw anyone out of the stadium who disrupts the enjoyment of others.
I’m convinced that this is a generational thing that might pass as the years roll on.
If you think about it, all of those alumni and fans who are in their 50’s, 60’s and 70’s, these people have never really lived through such a mediocre era of Irish football. There was a small amount of years while some of them were kids or teenagers where the team was no good and then another in the early to mid-1980’s.
But for the most part they grew up in their formative years with Notre Dame being THE school and a program that dominated college football year in and year out. Now, they’re old and not about to rise to the occasion as super fans to give the team any sort of advantage through increased crowd noise.
Catholic Disney World
I heard someone a while back call Notre Dame the Catholic Disney World and I thought that made a lot of sense.
We always talk about it all the time because there is so much to do and so much to see at Notre Dame that it really almost takes away from the football game itself and more importantly, makes it very difficult for the university not to cater to the people who have come to see the Grotto just as much as Armando Allen crossing the goal line.
Basically, this has cultivated a culture of "being nice" and "being classy" which is perfectly fine, except these traits spill into the stadium each Saturday and aren’t really conducive to helping a team win football games.
Some would argue that the university has become obsessed with being classy and maintaining it’s image as a "nice little place to watch football," and I tend to agree. Yet, when we’re talking about things like entertainment, home-field advantage, crowd noise and the like, schools need more of a rowdy shotgun-your- beer atmosphere instead of the wine and cheese atmosphere that exists during Notre Dame games.
In a way, the university has become a victim of its own success just as we’ve lived through a period in which the football team has gone in the opposite direction.
The school has become so popular in the 21st Century that there are still hundreds, if not thousands, of fans flocking to South Bend every weekend who have never seen Notre Dame and who are left in awe with its splendor and beauty.
What’s more, the university has become one of the elite institutions in the country and this has created a massive alumni network who attends games, pay good money to do so every year, but who don’t really enhance the environment. Also, many fit the category of people mentioned above (i.e. forget about them cheering).
In sum, the "problems" inside Notre Dame Stadium are as much cultural as anything.
Increasing the Entertainment Level
And now we find ourselves staring at the amenities that Notre Dame Stadium has been practically void of for the past 80 years: jumbotrons, music, promotions during break, etc.
The experience that still exists today at Notre Dame is as old-school as you’ll find in North American sports: Natural grass with no field paint except for slanted hash marks in the end zone, the only music from the two team’s bands, no advertising, and very limited use of the PA system.
One the one hand, this is a very important part of what makes Notre Dame the school that it is. And to be sure, there are a lot of people who hold this aspect of the football experience near and dear to their heart (they’ll be the ones screaming in the comment section DO NOT CHANGE ANYTHING…EVER!!).
However, the game has changed quite a bit since the early days of college football. Rockne never had to deal with television breaks and long timeouts. Leahy’s teams never had to deal with the crazy atmospheres you see today at LSU, Oregon, Nebraska and elsewhere.
The biggest problem nowadays is that fans are not entertained for a large majority of Notre Dame games and there are so many lulls in action that it rips apart any momentum the crowd has created.
Wouldn’t playing a song over the PA system before the team comes out or in between a timeout each quarter keep the fans more engaged?
I don’t think the stadium really needs a jumbotron at this point, but wouldn’t it be nice to be able to watch replays if only to keep the crowd busy and not twiddling their thumbs and sucking out the energy during challenges?
If at some point the university decides to make these changes I’ve said before that it can be done tastefully and not in the cheesy and cheap way most other schools do it. I think that is an important point to remember.
Winning Solves Everything
Most people will say that the Fighting Irish need to start winning like they used to and all of the problems associated with the stadium will go away.
I agree, but only to a point.
Of course the fans are going to be pumped up and loud during a close game or against a top opponent that is coming to town. That’s not really the problem here.
It’s more of the four or five other home games a year where the crowd is all but listless unless there is a big play or touchdown.
Like I said it’s a cultural thing and it’s something that is not easily changed. I agree with the premise that winning is a big part of changing the stadium atmosphere but isn’t that another way of saying that Notre Dame has a lot of fair-weather fans?
Maybe fair-weather fans isn’t the right label, but you don’t see this problem at other top schools and this kind of my point. Penn State is 3-3 right now and staring down the barrel of a very rough second half, so will Beaver Stadium be any less loud because of it?
Maybe a little bit, but it will still be loud and crazy as always.
So here we are this weekend with one of the weakest opponents to ever set foot inside Notre Dame Stadium with a threat of a non-sellout and a crowd that is likely to be asleep five minutes into the third quarter.
I love the tradition at Notre Dame, I really do, I just wish things were a little different.
So what do you think?
Does Notre Dame Stadium need small changes? Big changes? No changes at all?
Are any of my ideas good, or am I just crazy?
Sound off!
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NIGHT GAME. At least ONE a year. It will happen soon……
by Steve on Oct 15, 2010 5:15 AM EDT reply actions
Re running out of the tunnel, awning or no, why can’t the players and coaches wait until all of the players have left the ND dressing room, gone down the steps to the tunnel, touched the Play Like A Champion Today sign and are actually in the tunnel?
That is what bothers me the most. They start to run out onto the field before all of the players are actually in the tunnel. It happended during my first time ever attending a Fighting Irish football game last year and it happened again this year at my second ever attendance. It happens, so it seems, every time I watch them on TV.
Wait until all the players and coaches are actually in the tunnel before tunning out on the field to represent Our Lady.
Dan
by Dan on Oct 15, 2010 6:30 AM EDT reply actions
I agree with the players not running out until all players are in the tunnel. There should be someone who signals to Coach Kelly that all players are ready. He leads them out with the shillelagh in his hand.
I like the idea of the shillelagh being handed off to the leprechaun. But first I would do this:
I was at an Irish festival in Hunter Mt. NY a few years ago, at the end of the festival all of the people there look to the top of the mountain. After a minute or so you faintly hear the sound of bagpipes, it gets louder, and louder, until you see 100 bagpipers at the top of the mountain coming down. It gave you chills. ND needs to have 25 or so bagpipers start playing in the tunnel, slowly they come out, crowd goes crazy, team comes tearing out of the tunnel after the bagpipers. Coach Kelly hands off the shillelagh to the leprechaun, and ND Stadium is rocking and roaring!!!!!!
by Irish Thunder on Oct 15, 2010 8:10 AM EDT reply actions
Hey Irish Thunder:
I like your idea. I suggest we also get a several hundred gnomes and fairies to prance about while the bagpipers play. May be we have Peter Jackson produce the spectacle. While we are at it, I suggest we forget about the football game all together and just have it become a big lord of the rings extravaganza. Great Idea Irish Thunder! Maybe that will give you those Hunter Mountain Goose Bumps!
by Joey D on Oct 15, 2010 8:26 AM EDT reply actions
Steve,
Night games would most definitely jack up the atmosphere. The reasons why we haven’t seen any (or may see some in the future) are a good topic for another article. I would love at least one night game a year. Next year’s game at Michigan is going to be amazing.
by Eric Murtaugh on Oct 15, 2010 8:36 AM EDT reply actions
Dan,
Good idea about the players coming down from the locker room..I forgot to bring that up. The whole thing is usually poorly coordinated and you can tell that even more so when watching on television.
by Eric Murtaugh on Oct 15, 2010 8:38 AM EDT reply actions
Everything you say is right-on about ND stadium and the gameday experience. I just went and saw a game at Clemson and I only wish we had half of this excitement. Things need to change in a big way, or we will have trouble relating to the 18yo of today and this will affect recruiting.
by mark on Oct 15, 2010 8:40 AM EDT reply actions
Irish Thunder,
Interesting idea there with the bagpipes. The bagpipers on campus are pretty cool, you wonder why they are not involved more in the actual games inside the stadium.
One of the other ideas I had in the past was blasting a bagpipe song over the PA system before the team comes out…I think it would be a great addition to the gameday experience.
by Eric Murtaugh on Oct 15, 2010 8:43 AM EDT reply actions
Joey D,
Classic hater-ade of the variety I was not looking for.
So Irish Thunder wants to encorporate bagpipes into the stadium atmosphere and suddenly he doesn’t care about the football game and the experience will turn into some Lord of the Rings lame distraction?
That makes no sense at all. Do you feel that way when the Notre Dame Bagpipe Band plays in front of the dome before games too?
by Eric Murtaugh on Oct 15, 2010 8:46 AM EDT reply actions
Mark,
You’re right, the atmosphere pales in comparison to what you see at Clemson. I think ND’s tradition is so overwhelming that I don’t think the “problems” inside the stadium will affect recruiting that much, but it is definitely somethinig worth talking about.
by Eric Murtaugh on Oct 15, 2010 8:48 AM EDT reply actions
At least we don’t have a lion growling every 2 minutes like PSU.
If they were to build another press box like structure on the other side of the field, that would hold in more of the sound. They could use these as luxury boxes. They then could put in 4 monitors, one on each side of the press boxes to show videos and replays, these would blend in nicely. and would not have to be monstrous.
As far as the fans, yes there are very many people 50 and older, I’m one. That hardly keeps me from standing and yelling. The problem here I think, is fans being afraid to stand and cheer, because of the stories of fans being evicted from the stadium for doing so. This should not happen. Cheering should not be considered a disturbance. Kelly wants the team to defend their home, the fans want to help, they should not be punished for doing so.
Eric I was at the game last week also, I agree, the entrance was a clusterf&*k. I like the captain bringing out the shillelagh idea. But I thought the crowd on Pitts last two possesions did a good , if not great, job of creating noise. Consider that you are not going to get 20,000 of the fans to yell and scream no matter what.
by TLNDMA on Oct 15, 2010 8:52 AM EDT reply actions
Good timing on the article as I was at the Pitt game and this topic sparked much debate at the the pre- and post-game tailgate.
I agree that the Irish came out of the tunnel a little flat, but I don’t think that we need an awning, banner or anything else. I think they just need the captains or some other vocal leader (whether it be player or coach) to get them fired up in the tunnel all together and then have the take the field as one once that excitement has hit a crescendo. We can get fired up and explode out as a tema without AC/DC blaring.
I don’t want us to run ads and fill the stadium with crap, but a jumbotron or two would be helpful. Replays are great. They keep the crowd excited after a big play and biy would it have been nice in teh stands to see what the refs were looking at during some of the challenges. There is no reason that this could not be done in a way that maintains the taste and history fo the Stadium.
Nail on the head with the cultural issue and this can and will not change. Notre Dame Football weekend is more about Notre Dame and less about football. It tends to be about family trips, bringing kids to campus and reunions of old friends…all centered around a football game. As long as the games remain more about being a nice part of a campus visit as opposed to being the focus of a weekend with win being a must for the success of the weekend, it will be tough to have th atmosphere you are envisioning.
Go Irish!
by KwillND94 on Oct 15, 2010 9:09 AM EDT reply actions
I think the excitement comes when we win games. Leave the rest alone! If you want special effects and flashing lights, go to a game at Clemson.
by Cathy on Oct 15, 2010 9:13 AM EDT reply actions
Hey Murtaugh:
Back off the hater talk my friend!! My blood bleeds blue and gold babycakes!!!!!! The reason that I commented on Irish Blunder’s idea is that he is missing the point. Play great football and you solve the problem. It is that simple. No need to turn this place in a broadway theater to get the crowd into it. Have we become a minor league baseball team looking to gimmicks to get people in the crowds excited? Forget about it!!!! Coach Kelly will get us back to that level of play that I grew up around at ND. From what I see, we are well on our way back. No need for bag pipers, gnomes, fairies or any other lame brain idea from Irish Thumper. Keep the faith my friends. Go IRISH!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!
by Joey D on Oct 15, 2010 9:22 AM EDT reply actions
TLNDMA,
Yeah those lion roars are annoying.
Good idea with the luxury box on the other side, I think we’ll probably see that in the future. I also think that they would put replay monitors on the long sides too, more accessible to everyone and they wouldn’t obstruct the TD Jesus view.
Great point about some people being afraid to cheer. I’m not an overly outgoing person who cheers like crazy, but it would be nice to be able to stand up and cheer, get loud on 3rd down, etc. without feeling like an outcast in a sea of the hundred people around you.
by Eric Murtaugh on Oct 15, 2010 9:26 AM EDT reply actions
I am an alum who is surprised to hear how standing up to cheer is unwelcome and potentially cause for eviction. Does any other major team have the same restrictions? I agree that excitement gets sucked out of the stadium due to lots of commercials.
That’s the price we pay for the NBC contract…but can’t we blare some Irish music?
A solution that would solve everything is to join the Big Ten. Compare us playing Ohio Stare against Western Michigan or Tulsa in terms of interest, excitement, and crowd noise!!
by Geoff on Oct 15, 2010 9:29 AM EDT reply actions
Kwill,
It would be nice if the players or coaches could do it on their own but we have years of evidence that something is broke with the process. I bet if we asked the players their opinion they’d say it’s cool running out to 80,000+ people, but I know a lot of them would want some changes to how they come out.
There would be no need for advertisements in the stadium, even with a jumbotron. I agree, things can be added without ruining the taste and history. Shows us replays and maybe throw in a Rockne speech for good measure…who doesn’t want to see that?
The cultural thing is very hard to overcome. Sometimes I wish all the wonderful people who come could just flip a switch for 3 hours and go crazy during the games, but alas….
by Eric Murtaugh on Oct 15, 2010 9:30 AM EDT reply actions
Great post, it brings up many discussion points. Modifying the stadium experience at a place as tradition rich as Notre Dame will always be a slippery slope. I don’t think you could ever really incorporate a “Jock Jams” type element from the PA system or the hotly debated Jumbotron without a significant amount of push back from the alumni and the rest of the fan base. The opposite side press box/ luxury suites with smaller monitors might work though.
I actually love the starkness of the stadium itself and like to get in there when the gates first open just to appreciate said starkness before it fills up. The crowd itself will likely always have a more reserved personality than the crowd at some other places but I think the volume issue will improve as the team improves. I think Joey D’s logic is sound in that respect.
I totally agree that the entrance onto the field could improve, though I’m not sure what the best answer is there. I went to a couple of VT games with my Brother-in-law last year and I was pretty blown away by their entrance. I have never been in a stadium that was rocking like that. It was really impressive and it works there, but their “winning tradition” also dates back all of about 15 years which is the key difference. Things to ponder. Great Friday discussion….
by whiskey on Oct 15, 2010 9:40 AM EDT reply actions
Cathy & Joey D,
You’re missing a fundamental point of my argument.
Winning is an important part to improving the atmosphere but it is severely overstated especially with the ingrained culutre at ND for the past 15 years or so.
My point is, why does the team have to become dominant before fans and the stadium starts rocking? Shouldn’t the stadium be rocking all the time?
This is what I don’t understand. It’s like going to watch your children play a sport but not cheering if their team isn’t any good. “Sorry Billy, did you expect me and the other parents to cheer when you guys are 3-7 on the season?”
In a lot of ways, it’s just wrong. ND Stadium should be alive all the time. I understand that if it’s a truly horrible season or a blowout that the atmosphere will stink. But there have been so many instances over the years where it’s been a close game and the crowd is dead. Again, the game’s on the line, where is the crowd? If it was all about winning, they should be there.
Also, Joey D, you’re blowing the changes out of proportion. You can’t sit there and tell me that a few replay screens that don’t show ads and some bagpipers is going to turn the experience into a circus. Some day changes will be made and the beauty and tradition of Notre Dame will continue to live on.
by Eric Murtaugh on Oct 15, 2010 9:41 AM EDT reply actions
None of this was a problem in the late 80’s and early 90’s…
by CK on Oct 15, 2010 9:42 AM EDT reply actions
Geoff,
I’m not sure if other school’s have the same policy…I’m sure some do, but they probably aren’t enforced often. To be sure, I don’t think it happens a lot at ND (being thrown out that is), but people do get yelled at by other fans quite a bit.
Big Ten wouldn’t solve it…there’d still be Minnesota, Northwestern, Illinois and Indiana boring the hell out of the fans too.
by Eric Murtaugh on Oct 15, 2010 9:43 AM EDT reply actions
Whiskey,
I really like the idea of the added press box. I see that happening in the next 20 years.
I still don’t buy the “winning” cures all argument. I think the problems are deeper. It would help no doubt, but I think even if ND is 6-0 right now that the game against WMU this weekend would be just as boring.
It’s kind of like that Christian saying, “what credit should you get if you love those who love you?”
It’s easy to cheer for a winning and dominant team. We all know that.
by Eric Murtaugh on Oct 15, 2010 9:48 AM EDT reply actions
CK,
The times they are a changin’.
Those 40 and 50 year olds from back then are old men now. Transplant those dominant teams from the Holtz era today and I guarantee the atmosphere isn’t as electric as it was back then.
Winning is very important, but there’s still cultural problems deeply ingrained. ND as a school has changed quite a lot over the past 20 years.
by Eric Murtaugh on Oct 15, 2010 9:54 AM EDT reply actions
I can recall that during the first few years after the opening of the Georgia Dome in Atlanta, the Falcons complained that the noise level in the dome was defective. Then, they held the first SEC Championship game and almost blew the roof off. I was on the sidelines this year for the Boise State Virginia Tech game and it was the loudest game ever in Fed Ex Field (Redskins home). There is no doubt the loudest game I ever experienced in Notre Dame Stadium was the “Bush Push” ND USC game. Nothing contributes t the nise and excitement level mre than a winning Irish team facing a winning opponent! I am a 64 graduate of Notre Dame and I can assure you that I am as loud as any student at an Irish game!
by Don Sullivan on Oct 15, 2010 9:55 AM EDT reply actions
Quire frankly, winning will solve a lot of these aforementioned concerns. As far as how the team comes out of the tunnel, it’s what you do on the field during those 60 minutes that is most important. GO IRISH and GOD, Country, Notre Dame!
by Steve on Oct 15, 2010 10:05 AM EDT reply actions
Agree with your comments. Lets make some changes. I like the tunnel idea. Put some life into the entrance.
by mcIrish on Oct 15, 2010 10:06 AM EDT reply actions
pretty dou@hy to call out all the olds that have helped build the tradition and basically imply things will improve when they die. and tradition, you wouldn’t know it if it dropped on your head. you want to turn this school into some cheesy deal every other school does but thats the reason it’s special: we do it differently! your suggestions (jumbotron , metallic retractable awning) by definition can’t be done “tastefully.” and then complaining about the class level and dou@hing it down like every other place, just pathetic
by qb2333 on Oct 15, 2010 10:09 AM EDT reply actions
That WAS a cheap shot calling us old men. When we were in our 20’s we never spoke about the 40+ crowd as old men.
Wow, kids have changed. Why do we need jumbotrons rap music and extra press boxes to overindulge the XBOXing, cell phone carrying, text messaging, disrespectfuls?
LET’S JUST PLAY GREAT TEAMS AND WIN! NO MORE CUPCAKES!!
by AnotherOldMan on Oct 15, 2010 10:19 AM EDT reply actions
I just wish ND would come out of the tunnel last. Can’t we please get back to that? We’re still worried about fighting w/ the other team?
You wouldn’t introduce Michael Jordan first at a basketball game. You save the best for last to ramp up the excitement level.
by Neil on Oct 15, 2010 10:22 AM EDT reply actions
Nobody disagrees with the winning gets the Stadium rocking argument. The article fairly says lets have some fun. The team coming out of the tunnel together as one, following bagpipers would be a classic “Fighting Irish” entrance. Similar to Clemson touching “the rock” or Colorado running out after “Ralphie the Buffalo.”
ND has the bagpipers as part of the days events already, lets incorporate that into the team coming out. Hardly a “Gnomes/Fairies Circus????” Sounds like Joey D needs to chill in Coney Island.
by Irish Thunder on Oct 15, 2010 10:23 AM EDT reply actions
bagpipes would be ok as compared to now but it still is kind of a lame idea. play some dropkick murphy’s!
as for crowd noise, until some of the geriatrics die it’s never going to change. maybe everyone who actually wants to cheer should use the text system to report everyone who’s sitting the entire time. flood the system so they can’t respond to anything.
by brendan_g on Oct 15, 2010 10:43 AM EDT reply actions
Don,
I too heard it was very loud at Fed Ex early in the season. We appreciate your cheering and loudness during the games for sure!
by Eric Murtaugh on Oct 15, 2010 10:53 AM EDT reply actions
You’re an idiot, you’re probably onw of those people that has never picked up a ball or played a sport in thier life and thinks that every kid should get a giant trophy. What a joke of an article and quite frankly a waste of time. Notre Dame is special, it’s unlike anywhere in America. The tradition, the beautiful campus and most important the classy fans make it an experience unlike any. I don’t want ND to be like every other school. It doesn’t have to be a Hollywood production to be special. Appreciate the tradition and what the University and football program stands for, not the fake rock/rap music and animals being released onto the playing field. If you are truly a ND fan you understand then you appreciate the gameday experience. If you want Disney World go anywhere else. Trust me, once Coach Kelly gets this thing going the last thing people will worry about is how they enter the field or lame awnings. What a waste of journalism
by Jim on Oct 15, 2010 10:53 AM EDT reply actions
Steve,
Winning is very important, but it’s not all. There has to be some positives to take away from getting extra jacked up before the game. It is football after all.
I’d like to know what the players think. 80,000 golf claps is nice but….
by Eric Murtaugh on Oct 15, 2010 10:54 AM EDT reply actions
ND is not Clemson or Penn State and thats part of what the ND experiece is all about. I agree the team should enter the stadium as a team. I would even agree to some type of awning to heighten the excitment of the team entrance, but a jumbotron no way. As for the crowd if you win they will be excited even playing Western Michigan. That being said W Michigan is coming to ND and will give their best, dont assume a walkover is coming this weekend.
I guess im just a 49 year old classical type of fan. GO ND
by Jerry on Oct 15, 2010 11:00 AM EDT reply actions
qb & Old Man,
So the prevelance of old people who sit on their hands at the games isn’t a problem? We’re just going to ignore that because “they built the tradition?”
Look, I’m not saying that the “quiet ones” are bad people here, but to defend the country club atmosphere and lame energy levels as part of tradition, I cannot agree with that.
And you’re dead wrong about changes not being able to be tasteful.
You’re talking to a student of history and someone who knows just as much about ND’s traditions as anyone.
At some point in the past, people created new traditions and at some point in the future new traditions will be created. Tradition is not some static entity that never changes with time.
The fact is, Notre Dame is as much of a trail blazer of new ideas then it is about upholding tradition. I think a lot of people forget that. There can be sublte changes and new ideas to the gameday atmosphere that still keep the original tradition alive.
by Eric Murtaugh on Oct 15, 2010 11:02 AM EDT reply actions
I don’t know if I am crazy but I remember ND always came out of the tunnel second until the infamous Boston College game when they refused to take the field until ND did and we lost not only the game but the national championship. Ever since then I feel like we have been jinxed. I was hoping to see them come out second at the Perdue game. Anyone else remember this?
by Kevin M on Oct 15, 2010 11:02 AM EDT reply actions
Neil,
ND definitely needs to come out last.
by Eric Murtaugh on Oct 15, 2010 11:02 AM EDT reply actions
brendan,
I wouldn’t be opposed to the Murphy’s…but there would be some serious problems involved with that…we need baby steps first!
by Eric Murtaugh on Oct 15, 2010 11:03 AM EDT reply actions
Hi Eric, I bet if the youngsters really want the jumbotrons, us 40+ year olds will have to pay for it. Can we still come to the games if we buy a jumbotron for you?
by Kathy on Oct 15, 2010 11:08 AM EDT reply actions
Jim,
You couldn’t be more wrong about my past as an athlete, nice try on the low blow buddy.
Your comments typify everything I find disgusting when discussing this issue. You’re one of those who think that “tradition” means nothng is ever going to change on campus for the next 100 years.
What if Notre Dame pre-1960 thought the same way? Where did all of these traditions come from?
That’s right, someone in the past thought up new traditions and other ones withered and died. It’s called life.
I mean really, is anything proposed going to change the true nature and beauty of Notre Dame?
So the university puts in some replay boards and spices up the team’s entrance, all of a sudden all hope is lost? That’s the most ridiculous argument ever.
Your comment was lame as hell.
by Eric Murtaugh on Oct 15, 2010 11:13 AM EDT reply actions
Jerry,
If and or when ND goes up by 3 TD’s over Western Michigan you can call it a night as far as stadium loudness and excitement. It’s pretty much scientifically proven at this point.
by Eric Murtaugh on Oct 15, 2010 11:15 AM EDT reply actions
Kathy,
You’ve been “paying” for crappy football for 15 years and I’m assuming still showing up to enjoy the traditon.
Maybe the question should be, will you still show up if the jumbotron is indeed installed?
by Eric Murtaugh on Oct 15, 2010 11:19 AM EDT reply actions
Eric,
We want to make you kids happy. If we are still invited we will still come.
I’m sorry that the teams that we have been paying for are “crappy.” I didn’t realize that the “geriatric” crowd would be held accountable for that. Any suggestions on how the geriatric crowd can fix the crappy football issue? Have we hired the wrong coaches? Maybe we need to replace the coaches, athletic directors, etc with 20 something year olds? Although Alabama, Boise State, or Ohio State haven’t done that, let’s lead the way and start a new hiring tradition.
Does that make sense Eric?
by Kathy on Oct 15, 2010 11:35 AM EDT reply actions
I’ve been going to games since 1992 and the atmosphere on campuse before games has been the biggest change! It’s totally a wine & cheese atmosphere. That’s not how you set the tone for a game. Things need to be more lively. I know ND doesn’t want to promote drinking but how about a few more tents set up with TV’s, food, beer etc. Perhaps some student groups with organized cheering and parading throughout the campus to get folks jacked up. The tailgating scene is just so weak because of such a small parking lot.
by Dave on Oct 15, 2010 11:52 AM EDT reply actions
Irish Thunder is RIGHT ON THE MONEY! Your idea is awesome. Sombody needs to run with this!!!!
by Southside Irish Fan on Oct 15, 2010 11:55 AM EDT reply actions
As a 45 year old man I think everyone needs to ease up on Eric. Ideas are what ND and the US of A are all about. Keeping all things the same does not make sense. I think the Boston Red Sox have done it right. They did not sing “Sweet Caroline” in the 7th inning when Yaz and Teddy Baseball were playing, but it did not stop the Red Sox from starting a new tradition. They evolved. They kept the tradition of Fenway Park, but also adapted (seats over the Green Monster were at first mocked by the Old School Red Sox fans, but now it fits). We do not live in a time machine that stays in 1948. Some change should be welcome. Keeps us all young. The old school ND’ers need to evolve and except a “little change.” Your way is not always the perfect way. Do not penalize the young for ideas or their lack of money. Ideas are always good, the switch from leather helmets was a good thing. A classic bagpipers leading the team would be a small, but nice change with a nod to traditional Irish roots. No to DropKick Murphys, huge ads, jumbo trons. Yes to adding life to the players entering the field. Fire up the bagpipes and Coach Kelly handing off the shillelagh to the Leprechaun!!!!
I think new ideas that take in tradition (which is why bagpipers over the Drop Kick Murphy’s makes more sense). are
by Irish Thunder on Oct 15, 2010 11:55 AM EDT reply actions
The “geriatric” crowd is being held accountable for a certain portion of the lame atmosphere that permeates Irish football games. And more importantly, they are being held accountable, in my eyes, for refusing to allow anything new into the stadium.
That’s certainly not the attitude Knute Rockne rolled with and I shudder to think what this country would look like if generations of people refused any sort of change or even the slighest attempts at progress, all to up hold the mighty tradition of yesterday.
I’m sure there were people complaining when Rockne’s teams wore green jerseys. Now it’s a traditon.
I’m sure people were complaining when Notre Dame traveled by train all over the country to play a national schedule. Now it’s a tradition.
I’m sure there are tons of aspects of the gameday festivities that at some point in the past people railed against. Now they’re traditon.
It’s not such a cut and dry topic ma’am.
And oh yeah, the hiring of a 20-something worked for the Red Sox. Not all 20-somethings are brain-dead morons unaware or underappreciate of the past.
My stated goal is to improve the atmosphere inside the stadium without ruining the tradition as well. Some don’t think it’s possible and some don’t want it and some are downright immature about it. What can you do?
by Eric Murtaugh on Oct 15, 2010 11:57 AM EDT reply actions
Well put Irish Tunder.
The example of what the Red Sox did with Fenway is very pertinent.
by Eric Murtaugh on Oct 15, 2010 12:01 PM EDT reply actions
Why don’t you just move to State College and attend Penn State games if that’s what you are looking for…and by the way, Notre Dame is not a high school team, and running through a paper wall is about the worst suggestion I have ever heard someone make. I hope you weren’t serious with this whole piece.
by T on Oct 15, 2010 12:06 PM EDT reply actions
Here’s an example of how I think some overreact to these ideas.
Most of my proposals are quite small really. I concede that a jumbotron would be tough to pull off, but not if it was used solely for replays and especially if there were four small ones on the east and west sides of the stadium.
What I’m propsing is essentially a vaccination shot, just to make the experience more lively and fun for people.
You may agree with some of the ideas, you may not agree with any of them.
But some of you are acting like, “OH GREAT, NOW WE’RE GOING TO START SHOOTING NEEDLES INTO OUR ARMS AND BE LIKE EVERYONE ELSE HUH? YEAH THAT’S GREAT LET’S JUST RUIN THE WHOOOOOOOLE EXPERIENCE AND BECOME A BUNCH OF HERIONE ADDICTS, THAT WOULD BE REAL GREAT.”
by Eric Murtaugh on Oct 15, 2010 12:06 PM EDT reply actions
T,
You’re right, how dare I want Notre Dame to have a loud and boisterous stadium like many other schools. What was I thinking??
What’s wrong with running through the paper? Some would claim that Notre Dame has a very high school atmosphere during certain games…so wouldn’t it fit?
I kid of course, but I’m just throwing ideas out there.
by Eric Murtaugh on Oct 15, 2010 12:12 PM EDT reply actions
I don’t believe that winning is the answer to all the problems in the Stadium. We won last weekend and it was no more enjoyable than the last time I was at ND Stadium (Opening game against GT 4 years ago).
CK, it wasn’t a problem that no one had cell phones in the late 80’s and early 90’s, but that has worked out.
I am not suggesting that we sell out the program to become a cheap, football factory environment, but no one in the Stadium last week can sell me on the fact that they didn’t want to see what happened on what should have been intentional grounding or wouldn’t have liked to have seen a replay of Floyd going up over the DB for a touchdown.
The campus continues to expand and improve within the spirit of the University to better accomodate students and alumni. There is no reason we could not improve the entertainment value of the football games in the Stadium without selling our souls.
by KwillND94 on Oct 15, 2010 12:13 PM EDT reply actions
You think from some of these posts that you were suggesting the Irish go to flaming peach uniforms.
by Irish Thunder on Oct 15, 2010 12:16 PM EDT reply actions
Depends on the shade of peach (flaming peach is out of the question)
by Kathy on Oct 15, 2010 12:34 PM EDT reply actions
Anyone who starts a post with “you’re an idiot”, should do so while standing in front of a mirror.
by TLNDMA on Oct 15, 2010 12:35 PM EDT reply actions
Interesting article. First, I think the "problems" inside Notre Dame stadium are being overblown a bit. There are some valid points, but others I think are completely misguided. I agree…there are some things that should change. But careful not to change too much or you’ll kill the very things that makes the stadium experience memorable!
Two things I think are misguided:
1st…Jumbotrons…forget em. So many times I too have wanted to see a replay of a suspect call or great play while in ND stadium. However, I can also step back and say Im glad the Jumbotrons aren’t there. The benefit now is that you have every eye on the field, intent on every play…rather than people looking all over watching the game via the huge tv sets. Isnt that why people go to the game to begin with over watching at home? Also, for a stadium and a culture that embraces tradition and an old school sense of football, a Jumbotron would garishly go in the face of that.
2nd…Music…terrible idea. Cheesey in every sense of the word. Nothing is more annoying than going to sporting events where it is essentially a mini-DJ concert. Is it really necessary for me to have a sound bite from a song between every pitch at a baseball game or play of a football game? Either go to enjoy the game, or Stay home and play Rock Band. And same as my prior point, this idea goes against the aforementioned tradition/old school experience that people treasure about ND games.
That said, I agree that the crowd has become too "wine and cheese" (great way to describe it). Yes, part of it is generational, but that is no excuse. The ushers and ND administration need to promote an atmosphere that is free to be more racucous than politically correct. Granted, no one wants it to become a Raiders game. But it has to loosen its collar there.
Im intrigued about the shileleigh handoff idea. That sounds like it could be cool. I don’t think enclosing the tunnel is necessary…and a dome or banner to come out through is cheesey.
I do think a HUGE missing element is that our team enters the field first. As Kevin M said above…we used to let our opponents (like BC) first. Personally, I think it is the classier thing to do too. Let your guest go first. But even putting classy aside, letting the opponent go first has a few effects: a)building up emotion/ire against the opposition and b) drawing out anticipation/suspense (and eventual eruption) for when ND comes out. We could borrow a cue from Ancient Rome, where they brought the criminals out before the lions in the Colliiseum. The lions usually won!
by Dillon Big Red on Oct 15, 2010 12:58 PM EDT reply actions
It’s obvious why the atmosphere at ND stadium is funereal: there’s nothing special about the team, and there has been nothing special about it since Lou left. The team has been mediocre at best, and the administration has compounded the problem by scheduling teams like W. Michigan and Tulsa.
The quality, strength, and tradition of the team were always a source of pride and excitement. Big games against USC or Miami were the footbal equivalent of Lee vs. Meade at Gettysburg, and the victories and defeats were a source of great jubilation or disappointment.
Like Lincoln, we are looking for Grant and Sherman to fire up the troops and bring us meaningful victories. Until Kelly and Co. deliver consistent wins against quality opponents, other considerations like Jumbotrons or bagpipes are simply irrelevant, Disneyland nonsense.
by Patrick Mikes on Oct 15, 2010 1:12 PM EDT reply actions
Dillon,
I think a jumbotron could work, although it wouldn’t be easy. I think what most people think of is a giant Godzillatron like what Texas has. I wouldn’t want to go down that route obviously. But four much smaller screens for replays I think would still keep the traditional aspect of the stadium and wouldn’t ruin much. I know this is a very opionionated topic.
The music again, I think people just automatically visualize constant music blaring, annoying PA guys, dance music, rap music….when I don’t think that would ever, ever happen. I’m talking more about using the PA two or three times a game. Maybe right before the team comes out and in the 2nd or 4th quarters. It could be bagpipes, it could be some Irish folk song, it could be something tasteful. I would like to see people get more involved and excited. I don’t think it’s written anywhere in the school’s charter that fans should be made to look bored and uninterested during timeouts and other times during the game.
by Eric Murtaugh on Oct 15, 2010 1:26 PM EDT reply actions
Patrick Mikes,
Interesting analogies there.
No one is really excited to play Tulsa and WMU, but it’s not like the Irish never played bad teams before.
Don’t forget we still have the Army of Northern Virginia (in the form of Utah) marching towards us later this year.
by Eric Murtaugh on Oct 15, 2010 1:28 PM EDT reply actions
Irish folk songs??? What in the world are you talking about. I can just see it. Armando dashing to the end zone with Danny Boy blasting in the background. Or Crist over the middle to Floyd to the lovely lyrics of Whiskey in the Jar. Why not have the Clancy Brothers replace the marching band at halftime. That would be great to see on your Jumbotron. Have you no respect for tradition?
by Joey D on Oct 15, 2010 2:21 PM EDT reply actions
“Now, they’re old and not about to rise to the occasion as super fans to give the team any sort of advantage through increased crowd noise.”
Eric,
I’ve noticed this generational gap blaming over the last few years and as one representative of the gray-haired crowd I think it’s a cop out. My nephews and nieces know that I yell my lungs out until I am hoarse after the game. I can’t complain about the noise in the stadium for the Michigan game I attended this year or the USC game I attended last year.
You are right that we are used to winning (about 90% of home games when I went to school), but that does not necessarily translate into sitting on our butts – nor is age-driven.
Some of your ideas are good ones. Keep it up.
by Michael Collins on Oct 15, 2010 2:27 PM EDT reply actions
Michael:
Well said old timer. I like your spunk. I agree with your assessment 100%. I know when I was at the Purdue game this year, I saw plenty of old geezers, like you, screaming their butts off for ND. These young punks could certainly learn a thing or two about how to carry on tradition and cheer on their team. I personally would like to thank you for your years of loyalty and support to ND. It is a tribute to have a man at your age to be just attending the games let alone cheering with such enthusiasm. We owe a debt of gratitude to men of your generation who carried on the tradition through Rockne to Kelly.
GO IRISH!!!!!!!!!
by Joey D on Oct 15, 2010 2:53 PM EDT reply actions
Michael,
Of course not every single older person is refraining from yelling, that’s just ridiculous.
But I think there is a lot of credence to the baby boomer generation starting to age and a drop off in the excitement levels at ND games. There are a lot of factors, and that is one of them.
I understand that it offends those who actually do cheer and cheer their butts off, but this is a major complaint from a lot of people, not just me. We’re not making this up.
by Eric Murtaugh on Oct 15, 2010 3:17 PM EDT reply actions
Wow, lotta interest in this topic, as always — didn’t read all the comments but here’s this 20-something alumnus’ take — maybe it’s a little skewed because I have tended to sit in the student section for all but two games I’ve ever seen in the stadium, even since graduating: (a) I don’t really think there’s anything that wrong with the stadium experience as it is during any competitive game or one in which the Irish are winning, (b) related to (a) I tend to fall into the camp that believes winning fixes most, if not all “problems,” but © traditions can be respected, valued, and preserved while simultaneously keeping an open mind to tasteful new ideas (a hell of a lot of bagpipes sounds like a pretty cool idea to me).
I just don’t care much about how the team comes out of the tunnel. I’m jacked up enough that I’m under the Dome on game-day and am probably just rushing in from the tailgate lot anyway.
While a student, I attended ND-Tennessee at Neyland (considered among the loudest, if not the loudest in CFB), as well as the ‘05 USC-ND game in South Bend. It was either a wash or Notre Dame Stadium was louder (Herbstreit expressed similar sentiments after the game). Of course, that doesn’t mean the place couldn’t be louder during less exciting match-ups, but there’s nothing so fundamentally wrong about the acoustics that requires fixing for the fans to make a lot of noise if they care to do so. I have witnessed plenty of other occasions when the place got pretty loud.
This leads to your point about the cultural differences and there’s not much to be done about that. If the team isn’t doing so well, you don’t have to cheer so much. It’s nice if you do, but you don’t have to. Also, standing up the entire game is exhausting even for college kids, but frankly, if you can’t stand up for exciting moments, then (a) accept that you’re going to have to miss parts of the action, or (b) watch the game on TV. You cannot reasonably ask others to suppress their natural excitement at a football game.
When the guys from Everyday Should Be Saturday visited for the UCLA-ND game in ‘06, they compared Notre Dame to Wimbledon. This was neither meant to be a favorable nor unfavorable comparison, but it did speak to many of the old-school aspects of Nore Dame Stadium. I agree with their assessment that the lack of a Jumbo-tron forces you to pay more attention to the field (although maybe this doesn’t help with the issue of older folks being vocal about having their view blocked). The only reason the Jumbotron thing is ever talked about is because it was leaked that the athletic department looked into it a few years back. I am anti-Jumbotron, but assessing its potential value was an appropriate move by the athletic department as every other stadium in the nation has one and it would generate HUGE revenue for the University and its mission — ideas should never be off the table for examination and discussion, neither at a University nor any other well-run institution/business.
Discussing the concept of change is fine, but there will not be any significant changes made. inside the stadium. Kevin White once expressed to me the insane level of backlash he received just for adding the word “Irish” to the outside of the tunnel. Most people didn’t notice it or care, but I guess plenty did. This contingent of people makes the administration fearful of any type of change, no matter how modest or benign.
And to those of you that fall into this overly-traditional group, I must agree with Eric’s sentiments and emphatically remind you that Notre Dame became Notre Dame because it embraced innovation and adaptation. The marching band, the forward pass, and a national schedule of opponents come to mind. As far as most of the country is concerned, the “Play Like a Champion Today” sign is ingrained in the lore, yet it wasn’t put up until the 80’s. The famous Leprechaun didn’t replace an Irish Terrier as our field mascot until the ‘50s. The green jerseys didn’t show up until the 70’s (correct me, Eric, if my history is off and that should say “re-introduced”). Hell, girls weren’t even allowed to attend the University until ‘72, I believe. Do all of the traditionalists hold to the idea that ND should’ve remained an all-boys school?
And, for the record, I actually think the yellow flowers on the sideline are kinda nice, but wouldn’t mind Subway Domer’s idea of replacing them with Memento Mori skulls. Seriously, that would be freaking awesome and fully in line with 2 millennia of Catholic tradition — but it will never happen … maybe just before All Soul’s Day?
by pablo on Oct 15, 2010 3:18 PM EDT reply actions
Joey D,
Did you know that one of the newer songs the band plays (introduced less than ~10 years ago) is a celtic war chant? It’s been a great addition to the game.
But, I better get you into contact with Dr. Kenneth Dye so you can tell him that was not originally part of the school’s tradition and that it is lame and should be removed from gameday festivities.
Man that sucks, I still know and respect the tradition of the school more than you. It’s just you can’t accept that sometimes things change…aww that’s cute though.
by Eric Murtaugh on Oct 15, 2010 3:23 PM EDT reply actions
Pablo,
The green jerseys were first worn in 1921. Among the oldest of ND’s traditions. They were worn sporadically through the 1930’s and for seasons at a time in the 40’s and 50’s.
Ara ended the green jerseys for good, until Devine famously brought them out for the ’77 USC game and then for the next three or four years.
Great comments too by you….good stuff.
by Eric Murtaugh on Oct 15, 2010 3:27 PM EDT reply actions
Greetings all!
I’ve very much enjoyed this discussion, and there’s one point I’d like to make.
In regards to wanting to see the Irish storm the field after the opposing team goes first at our home games, I’m afraid we may never see that again. I’m pretty sure that a number of years ago the NCAA made it a rule that the home team must hit the field first. Someone please correct me if I am mistaken on this. Thanks!
Go Irish!!!
by Avon Domer on Oct 15, 2010 3:27 PM EDT reply actions
So Patrick Mikes, we do not come up with new ideas until the team is undefeated?? The ideas were to create a fun experience at the game. Some years you are winning, some years you are not. The ND administration tries to put a winner on the field, and also create a fun Saturday for the loyal fans. Is that so bad????? There is not one person on this blog who does not agree that a Top 5 winning program would solve the dull stadium noise. But why not have fun creating other things to add to the Saturday football experience. Or do I have to wear a wool Civil War uniform to the game as well? Why can’t we have bagpipers lead the team out? It would be fun “Irish tradition.” We cannot come up with new traditions???
by Irish Thunder on Oct 15, 2010 3:29 PM EDT reply actions
Good article. I attended the MSU-Wisconsin game which was nationally televised so it had a similar number of television time outs. MSU has a jumbotron and they play music. That combo kept the crowd in the game the whole time except for just 1 time out. Only once was there that pin drop silence during the time out which ND Stadium has probably 3 times each quarter. So, yes winning is the biggest thing. But secondly, there is too much time out time that’s filled with silence. We need music and the jumbotron – well done, but both, plus winning, will make that stadium rock! Its actually pretty simple.
by Drew Schmidt on Oct 15, 2010 3:29 PM EDT reply actions
You know what the team should do? They should wait until we have a really big game. Then come out for warmups in their blue jerseys. Then after warmups go to the locker room and change into GREEN jerseys. Then come out of the tunnel and the crowd will go CRAZY!!…..good idea ..huh?
Seriously.. I think one of the problems is the long delays during timeouts….. As it is they bring out about a dozen individuals or teams to be recognized during these breaks. They could enhance these ceremonies with small video screens showing footage of the teams or players being honored. Would’nt it have been nice last week to see some film of Joe Theisman and the 1970 team. At other breaks they could run scores from aound the country. I’m sure they could come up with many things that would keep people from having their enthusiasum sucked out of them by the delays.
by TLNDMA on Oct 15, 2010 3:45 PM EDT reply actions
Avon Domer,
Good question and I’m not sure what the NCAA rule is there.
Do you happen to live near Avon Old Farms?
by Eric Murtaugh on Oct 15, 2010 4:10 PM EDT reply actions
Irish Thunder,
The wool Civil War uniform comment had me on the floor. That was great!
by Eric Murtaugh on Oct 15, 2010 4:12 PM EDT reply actions
TLNDMA,
One of the biggest reasons I’ve been a proponent of having a jumbotron is specicifically to enhance Notre Dame’s history and tradition.
*Rockne speeches
*Clips of old games
*Rudy
*Messages from former players & coaches
I mean Notre Dame has a boat load of stuff that could be fun and revolve around all of the traditions of the past. You could go on and on with the amount of footage that the fans would love.
I understand why some people don’t want the jumbotron there, but damn…I would find that pretty awesome.
by Eric Murtaugh on Oct 15, 2010 4:15 PM EDT reply actions
Hi Eric,
I have to admit that I’m not familiar with Avon Old Farms. I live in Avon, Indiana, (western suburb of Indianapolis) and I’ve been attending Notre Dame games for 37 seasons.
In regards to pumping in music during our games, I don’t think it’s necessary. ND has the finest marching band I’ve ever heard, and between their songs and drum cadences I’ve always been very well entertained during time outs.
While I am a traditionist when comes to all things Notre Dame, I would like to see Jumbotrons in the stadium, solely for the purposes of showing videos about the University, videos about the football team and it’s history, replays of the game, stats and out of town scores. The first time I’d see a commercial of any kind shown on a Jumbotron in Notre Dame Stadium I’d rip it out with my bare hands.
GO IRISH!!
by Avon Domer on Oct 15, 2010 4:24 PM EDT reply actions
Avon,
I thought maybe you lived in Massachussetts, but you don’t!
I am with you on the jumbotron idea too. We probably wouldn’t need music at all if we kept fans entertained with Notre Dame videos. It’s a good idea I think.
by Eric Murtaugh on Oct 15, 2010 5:15 PM EDT reply actions
The culture is the only problem. Football crowds should be rowdy, not cordial, when it is game time. Good point there. I disagree with all other points, hopefully not in a hateful way. We add an awning to the tunnel in 1987 and no one sees the Catholics and Convicts pushing and shoving pregame. It doesn’t get more intense than that. Dancing and chest bumping are showboating. Play with intensity, concentration, and… class. I don’t want to be Miami. Music through the PA and a jumbotron are for the NFL. ND Stadium is, by definition, an old school experience. Nothing flashy, nothing in your face, just football. If you want a replay you should probably watch at home. Maintain interest between plays or during commercials by thinking about play calling, execution, situational strategy, football. We can blast AC/DC when we join the Big Ten.
by IrishGreg on Oct 15, 2010 6:33 PM EDT reply actions
“I think there is a lot of credence to the baby boomer generation starting to age and a drop off in the excitement levels at ND games.”
Again, not to diminish anyone’s perception, this is a cop out. When I was a student, I am sure that the age of those outside of the student section was not that much different, though perhaps of a different socioeconomic background, as is the general student population.
“The ‘geriatric’ crowd is being held accountable for a certain portion of the lame atmosphere that permeates Irish football games. And more importantly, they are being held accountable, in my eyes, for refusing to allow anything new into the stadium.”
You’ve made yourself clear. I’ve looked at the solution to be better coaching and a stronger defense. Your solution to the “lame atmosphere”?
by Michael Collins on Oct 15, 2010 8:17 PM EDT reply actions
I’m not a complete expert, but hasn’t the school changed since you were in school? Decades ago it was more rowdy. The student population was much more working class, if we go back far enough, all male. The school was very strong academically, but not where it is today.
Now, the student popluation is a lot less working class. A lot more minorities, more international students, more girls, just a lot more people who didn’t really factor in the football team as a reason to come to South Bend.
Now, the school is among the elite of elite academically and that has changed the culture rather severely I would think. This has created the Catholic Disney World culture that is positively obsessed with being classy that has really accelerated intensely since Notre Dame’s last glory years.
I don’t think the stadium atmosphere should be blamed entirely on the “older” folks, but we’re talking about the largest generation in the history of the country, just a shit ton of baby boomers who are now the alumni mainstays and maybe unfairly take the blame because they are the most visible. I’ve witnessed this behavior with my own eyes and it seems to be the No. 1 complaint from fans at the games.
Plus, the times have changed and the atmosphere at ND sticks out like a sore thumb whereas decades ago it didn’t. Other stadiums are louder, more intimidating, jacked up and ready to rumble. But ND is still stuck in 1946.
Better coaching, defense and winning will obviously help out a lot, perhaps eliminate most if not all of the problems we’re discussing. But I think that’s just as slippery of a slope as making some changes to the stadium gameday experience.
Becuase it’s not simply about just winning. It has to be dominance. It has to be dramatic victories. It has to be big wins against the top teams in the country.
I’m not saying that ND won’t ever do that again, but I just think it is rather a dream more than anything set in reality. Notre Dame is never going to play 6 ranked teams a year. Notre Dame is never going to go undefeated, if only once in a blue moon.
If we’re lucky, Kelly will string together a bunch of great seasons, but then what once he’s gone? That’s the problem I have with the “winning cures all” argument. Of course, it’s obvious that winning would make everything better, but you can’t expect sustained excellence each and every year.
Tomorrow’s game is an excellent test-case. If winning was all the stadium needed then it should be very loud if we expect the Irish to crush WMU. But it won’t be, because it doesn’t meet the prescribed criteria of what the fans need in order to cheer loudly. If Notre Dame goes up by two or three scores, the crowd will quiet down considerably.
Even when Utah comes to down and if their undefeated, there are only a small amount of circumstances that would create an energetic crowd. If the Utes go up by 10 or more, the crowd will die. If it was really about winning, the crowd would stay loud to help the team out, but it won’t.
All of these things I’ve mentioned have produced a culture and atmosphere that is really indifferent to winning football games. Last year at the game I attended I was apalled at the number of people who didn’t seem to give a crap about what was going on. At numerous points during the game I literally could have taken a nap. And it was a close game too. After the game I was probably more upset with how the crowd acted as they shuffled out of the stadium completely unaffected by what they just watched as much as I was with the loss itself.
I just don’t see why the stadium experience can’t be a little different and a little more lively, when Notre Dame is awesome, when they are struggling, when they are losing, when they are winning, all the friggin’ time. Winning would help but why do we need a giant check list and perfect storm of a match up (ND has to be good, opponent has to be good, game has to be close, or ND winning comfortably, etc.) to get a great crowd?
Like I said before on another comment, Notre Dame could be 6-0 tomorrow and it wouldn’t change the atmosphere much. The culture is still in place and WMU isn’t an opponent that is going to stir the fans up. Which means, for the most part, the crowd will be as loud as if the game were being played in Kalamazoo.
by Eric Murtaugh on Oct 15, 2010 10:40 PM EDT reply actions
Eric finally someone gets it like I have seen it 1. Pineapple dome for pep rallies no britney spears bubble gum pop get your team up music time for some marilyn manson nine inch nails combichrist music rip your head off methods baby!! 4 horseman literally in brave heart outfits coming through the tunnel on horseback if USC has 1 horse we can 4 baby or we can recruit lucifer’s children from across campus and dress them up in old brave heart outfits spears and shilaghlahs in head charging with or along side of the team with smoke machines and classy retratable overhang from the tunnel and yes build up music that touxhes the emotion of the fans and as one guy said we neeeeeed night games at homeat least the 1st game and the last game of each year!!
by Rockne on Oct 16, 2010 6:15 AM EDT reply actions
ND should be ashamed of such tight seating just to make an extra buck. I’ve been to two games this season and the space for a rear end and shoulder room is way under what is recommeneded for stadium seating for the public. Everyone around us was very uncomfortable. and the seats are just 2 X 8’s in depth.
by tom on Oct 16, 2010 9:56 AM EDT reply actions
Rockne,
Those are some very imaginative ideas you have. I’ll leave it at that. :)
by Eric Murtaugh on Oct 16, 2010 12:56 PM EDT reply actions
Tom,
The seating is very uncomfortable, I had a tall guy all up in my back at my last game…it’s no fun.
by Eric Murtaugh on Oct 16, 2010 12:57 PM EDT reply actions
Hey Big E!!!!
I agree with the seating comment. I had to sit in the middle section and nearly crapped my pants stuck in a center seat. Note to fans: avoid the hot dogs!!!! Buyer beware if you no what I mean. I should have hung out by the RV’s.
E Dog: I love your ideas. The crowd is nothing but a bunch of old timers bringing the energy down. Lame central!!!! Lets get some young blood cheering. Your theory of “Out with the old and in with the new” is spot on. I love your idea about the bag pipers!!! We are all Irish. Who does not love the bag pipers. Lets embrace it. The crowd would go nuts with bagpipers cranking it out. Even better, do it on the big screens like every other stadium as you suggest. I have always felt this was something that ND lacked especially with our history. How fired up would the crowd get with a Rockne speech or a Holtz pep talk to the sound of a bag piper!!!!!! Change is good my friends. Lets tip our hats to Kelly!!!! I love his fire. ND is back. As E-Dog says bring on the big screens, bring on the bag pipers, get rid of the old timers and get ready for prime time football at South Bend!!!!! GO IRISH!!!!!!! GOOOOOOOOOOOOOO IIIIIIIIIIRISSHHHHHH!!! Great article E.
by Bobby J on Oct 16, 2010 9:39 PM EDT reply actions
ND does not have the choice as to whether they come onto the field first or last. It has nothing to do with worrying about a brawl in the Tunnel.
I disagree with the NCAA rules, but the visiting team gets the choice of whether they want to come out first or last.
by KwillND94 on Oct 18, 2010 12:35 PM EDT reply actions
So that’s the rule eh Kwill?
I didn’t think it had to do with the Miami brawl because that happened as the ’Canes were heading back into the locker room after warmups and not coming out right before the game.
If I were the visiting team I would always come out second too. Dumb rule.
by Eric Murtaugh on Oct 18, 2010 2:42 PM EDT reply actions
I’m a little late to this discussion, but here’s my 2+ cents:
My dad (ND ‘59) started bringing me to games 41 years ago – there were tons of “geezers” in the crowd then and he tells me that there were tons when he was a student. When I was a student in the early eighties, the age demographic of the crowd hadn’t changed. That is one thing that’ll never change. I hope that I’m still coming to games 41 years from now!
Secondly, in discussing the bowl shape of the stadium, one major feature has been left out: it is much, much louder down on the field that it is in the seats. I didn’t understand this until I marched onto the field as a freshman in the Band of the Fighting Irish for the ’82 ND-UM game – the first night game at ND. It was so loud down on the field that I nearly forgot how to play.
by Ron on Oct 22, 2010 12:05 AM EDT reply actions
I was hoping to view more how they manage the battle of trying to break in and live a typical life which I guess up to the first major crisis it does deal with to some extent. But after that life outer to the mangaka cosmos looks to be dismissed. Maybe thats the answer, that this domain is all consuming.
by Chi Misrahi on Oct 27, 2010 3:36 PM EDT reply actions
The idea of 25 bag pipers is fine but in actuality the group that forms the bagpipe band right now about 8 pipers is pieced together from students, professors and students from Holy Cross, some of the drummers are from Saint Mary’s. What I’m saying is that it’s not like there are 25 or 30 bagpipers running around on campus, it’s actually tough for them to put together a squad some years with graduation ect. I’m looking into doing some fund raising for the bag pipe band send me an e mail Eric, if you have any ideas.
by Jim Sheridan on Nov 3, 2010 10:39 AM EDT reply actions
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